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Help Growing Japanese Maples From Seeds
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Author:  Paul B [Swindon] [ 04 Apr 2019, 13:55 ]
Post subject:  Re: Help Growing Japanese Maples From Seeds
Never had a problem with seeds or cuttings......... maybe I am just lucky.

BUT........ never from a packet that has probably been sitting around for ages.

In a seal able plastic bag with damp sphagnum moss for about 3/4 weeks in a fridge. Better early in the year
Author:  sputnik [ 04 Apr 2019, 15:07 ]
Post subject:  Re: Help Growing Japanese Maples From Seeds
Success with the seeds will totally depend on how they have been kept since collection. I probably get about 90% germination rate with my acer seeds but they are all collected from the tree or the ground around it and put into the fridge soon after. I have only once used bought seed and the success rate was lower. Be very careful not to make your soil too moist as they will develop fungal problems if you do so.
Author:  sputnik [ 04 Apr 2019, 15:34 ]
Post subject:  Re: Help Growing Japanese Maples From Seeds
BonsaiMax wrote:
sputnik wrote:
Like Paul I collect acer seeds in September but I put mine in the fridge to stratify. I have a shallow lidded plastic box (Chinese takeaway container) half filled with sand into which I put my seeds. This goes into the fridge and after a couple of months they start to germinate. They take different lengths of time so I just remove them as they pop and plant them leaving the others in the fridge. They can take more than a year so you don’t end up with too many to deal with at any one time. You do end up with a variety of different seedlings this way, some more suitable than others, but that’s part of the fun. A purchased named cultivar will give you more predictability but you do have to contend with the graft.


Thanks for your input! :smallthumb:

I've taken your advice on the takeaway container and will be using a very small one for the seeds with a bit of moist soil... Time will reveal all... or nothing :grin:

I am an absolute beginner in all things gardening and bonsai, so when you say contend with the graft what do you mean? From a quick look online it says grafting is a technique to turn two trees/plants into one.... I did not even know something like this was even possible :shock:


This is a grafted garden centre acer and as you can see the trunk shows an obvious join which may still be visible after the tree has grown and the trunk thickened. A tree grown from seed or cuttings will have a clean unblemished trunk which is preferable for bonsai. Some of the more unusual acer cultivars have to be grafted onto a more robust rootbase.

ImageUntitled by Sputnik184, on Flickr
Author:  BonsaiMax [ 04 Apr 2019, 18:24 ]
Post subject:  Re: Help Growing Japanese Maples From Seeds
Paul B [Swindon] wrote:
Never had a problem with seeds or cuttings......... maybe I am just lucky.

BUT........ never from a packet that has probably been sitting around for ages.

In a seal able plastic bag with damp sphagnum moss for about 3/4 weeks in a fridge. Better early in the year


I'm certainly trying my luck with these Paul... Fingers crossed :mrgreen:
Author:  BonsaiMax [ 04 Apr 2019, 18:26 ]
Post subject:  Re: Help Growing Japanese Maples From Seeds
sputnik wrote:
Success with the seeds will totally depend on how they have been kept since collection. I probably get about 90% germination rate with my acer seeds but they are all collected from the tree or the ground around it and put into the fridge soon after. I have only once used bought seed and the success rate was lower. Be very careful not to make your soil too moist as they will develop fungal problems if you do so.


There's a new bag of soil lying around, I'll check how moist this is and if needed give it a very light spray with the hand spray :smallthumb:
Author:  BonsaiMax [ 04 Apr 2019, 18:29 ]
Post subject:  Re: Help Growing Japanese Maples From Seeds
sputnik wrote:
BonsaiMax wrote:
sputnik wrote:
Like Paul I collect acer seeds in September but I put mine in the fridge to stratify. I have a shallow lidded plastic box (Chinese takeaway container) half filled with sand into which I put my seeds. This goes into the fridge and after a couple of months they start to germinate. They take different lengths of time so I just remove them as they pop and plant them leaving the others in the fridge. They can take more than a year so you don’t end up with too many to deal with at any one time. You do end up with a variety of different seedlings this way, some more suitable than others, but that’s part of the fun. A purchased named cultivar will give you more predictability but you do have to contend with the graft.


Thanks for your input! :smallthumb:

I've taken your advice on the takeaway container and will be using a very small one for the seeds with a bit of moist soil... Time will reveal all... or nothing :grin:

I am an absolute beginner in all things gardening and bonsai, so when you say contend with the graft what do you mean? From a quick look online it says grafting is a technique to turn two trees/plants into one.... I did not even know something like this was even possible :shock:


This is a grafted garden centre acer and as you can see the trunk shows an obvious join which may still be visible after the tree has grown and the trunk thickened. A tree grown from seed or cuttings will have a clean unblemished trunk which is preferable for bonsai. Some of the more unusual acer cultivars have to be grafted onto a more robust rootbase.

ImageUntitled by Sputnik184, on Flickr


So this is typically done to provide a stronger rootbase for the tree to grow with, which I guess means some trees root system isn't always up for the job? Please correct me if my thinking is wrong :smallthumb:

I never knew this was even possible :shock: :lol:
Author:  Gary Jones [ 05 Apr 2019, 00:31 ]
Post subject:  Re: Help Growing Japanese Maples From Seeds
BonsaiMax wrote:
So this is typically done to provide a stronger rootbase for the tree to grow with, which I guess means some trees root system isn't always up for the job? Please correct me if my thinking is wrong :smallthumb:

I never knew this was even possible :shock: :lol:


Yes. Many cultivars (plants that can't be reproduced by seed but only vegetatively) are individual specimens that are simply very weak on their own roots. I suspect the genetic change that makes them attractive in some way (colour, shape etc) also weakens them. Some cultivars only need to be taken as cuttings to propagate the true line, others need to be grafted as well. Sometimes those that are grafted will grow on their own roots but not as strongly, which is why the grafting method is often used. In a commercial garden tree scenario this makes perfect sense - for bonsai it's not often ideal as the graft union may be deemed unattractive. It's always preferred to have an un-grafted tree over a grafted one but this is not always possible. Grafting is also possible across species in the same family. White pine is often grafted on black pine. Paul's Scarlett red hawthorn (Crataegus laevigata) often on common white hawthorn (Crataegus monogyna). Juniper foliage from one variety (considered more attractive from a bonsai perspective e.g more compact) may be grafted onto the trunk and branches of a stronger variety. And as we've established many maples are grafted.
Author:  BonsaiMax [ 05 Apr 2019, 14:12 ]
Post subject:  Re: Help Growing Japanese Maples From Seeds
Gary Jones wrote:
BonsaiMax wrote:
So this is typically done to provide a stronger rootbase for the tree to grow with, which I guess means some trees root system isn't always up for the job? Please correct me if my thinking is wrong :smallthumb:

I never knew this was even possible :shock: :lol:


Yes. Many cultivars (plants that can't be reproduced by seed but only vegetatively) are individual specimens that are simply very weak on their own roots. I suspect the genetic change that makes them attractive in some way (colour, shape etc) also weakens them. Some cultivars only need to be taken as cuttings to propagate the true line, others need to be grafted as well. Sometimes those that are grafted will grow on their own roots but not as strongly, which is why the grafting method is often used. In a commercial garden tree scenario this makes perfect sense - for bonsai it's not often ideal as the graft union may be deemed unattractive. It's always preferred to have an un-grafted tree over a grafted one but this is not always possible. Grafting is also possible across species in the same family. White pine is often grafted on black pine. Paul's Scarlett red hawthorn (Crataegus laevigata) often on common white hawthorn (Crataegus monogyna). Juniper foliage from one variety (considered more attractive from a bonsai perspective e.g more compact) may be grafted onto the trunk and branches of a stronger variety. And as we've established many maples are grafted.


Ah ok, so trees can only typically be grafted to trees from the same family or very similar in most cases?

Thanks for the knowledge Gary, it's very interesting information to learn :smallthumb:
Author:  BonsaiMax [ 05 Apr 2019, 14:14 ]
Post subject:  Re: Help Growing Japanese Maples From Seeds
:21cop: UPDATE :21cop:

Seeds are now in the fridge... I'll keep you all updated over the next 2-3 months :grin:
Author:  Koren [ 06 Apr 2019, 17:07 ]
Post subject:  Re: Help Growing Japanese Maples From Seeds
The fact that many of them are floating isn't a good sign. I bought some maple seeds from Herons bonsai last year (80+ seeds) I planted half in a seed tray filled with Tesco cat litter without stratifying in the fridge, and only one sprouted. This year, I cold stratified the remaining 40 in the fridge, and many sprouted (a few weeks to a month ago, I think?), but also a whole bunch of the ones I'd planted last year started to sprout too. There was the beginnings of mould in the sealed bag in the fridge though. You're a little late in the year for it, and ideally you want to start with more than 10 seeds, but it might work. Shame the instructions on the packet are talking a load of rubbish to make it sound easy!
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